Much Odor About Trash

Garbage, or as the engineered like to refer to it, solid waste, is not a subject that most people gather around the proverbial kitchen table to discuss. Unless it’s about who is taking the trash out the night before pickup. Once the cans hit the curb though, that is usually the end of the thought process about what happens next. Yet, what happens next is precisely the part that has preoccupied so few in town that on a rainy Wednesday night 45 people filled the community room, with the lead pipe and Professor Plum Crazy. Of those 45, by my count, half were political flunkies. Of the non political flunkie set, there were clusters of representatives from trash hauling companies and the press. What’s the frequency kenneth?

Highlights of the meeting involved the usual display of Sturm und Drang helped by mother nature. some highlights. State Rep Bruce Morris apparently believes that public hearings shouldn’t be held on Wednesday nights because it was a Bible study night. Democratic Town Chair Gail Wall doesn’t want this public hearing held on this particular Wednesday because it was the night of Brien McMahon’s graduation. And the company that lost the bid, and then asked to submit a new bid undercutting the price of the winning bid, spoke about how they would be cheaper. Which prompted a reportedly heated exchange between DPW Director Hal Alvord and the company reps culminating in Alvord’s declaration that the action was “sleazy.”

Once again, the drama overshadows the issue. So a recap. CRRA hauls away trash from the Transfer station at Crescent Street and delivers it to Wheelabrator in Bridgeport, where it burns, baby, burns. This process costs us $81/ton, approximately, and will rise to $92/ton as soon as the contract expires at the end of the year, and maybe more in the months that follow. The proposal is to switch from CRRA to City Carting. And, this is the part that confuses people, separate the trash along the lines of commercial and residential. Currently all trash goes to Crescent street and some privately hauled trash goes to Meadow Street. The Meadow Street facility has been operated by Waste Management. Just to be clear, trash is being hauled to both facilities right now.

Residents of Village Creek and Harborview already are quite familiar with City Carting, because their trash is not collected by the City of Norwalk. Much of Norwalk, actually, has private trash collection, which makes it somewhat ironic that some of these very same residents have never inquired as to where their trash goes once it leaves those Belgian block curbs. Would it surprise anyone to find out that Meadow Street is a first stop?

A series of questions have been raised, which are interesting only to the extent that you look at them in context of current operations. A handy Chart:

  1. To what extent will truck traffic increase? (both trash trucks and large haul-off trucks)
    1. Currently: No Control Proposed: Can Control
  2. How noisy will that truck traffic be and when will it start? 4 AM?
    1. Currently: No Control (no evidence of 4am operations) Proposed: Can Control
  3. How will garbage odors be minimized or eliminated?
    1. Currently: No Control Proposed: Can Control
  4. Will the truck traffic be directed down Martin Luther King Drive to keep it off the already congested end of Meadow Street at Woodward Ave?
    1. Currently: No Control Proposed: Can Control
  5. Given the larger facility, does the city seek to expand its trash processing volume from the current Norwalk+Wilton processing to additional towns?
    1. Currently: Anyone Who Pays Can Dump Proposed: Anyone Who Pays Can Dump
  6. What recourse will Norwalk have to enforce City Carting’s promise to control odors, noise and traffic, as well as environmental degradation of the property?
    1. Currently: None Proposed: Yes

Naturally, the Common Council is incapable of separating fact from fiction and is inclined to render itself into a body of inaction while the very simple process of reading the proposal, comparing it to current operations, is ignored. Which stinks.

It stinks more when we look at the the FY 2008-09 city budget. Naturally, this same Common Council voted to approve a budget based on paying the contracted tipping fee to CRAA through the end of the year. And nothing more to accommodate the increased fees should the City stay with current operations and CRRA. So through inaction, the trash hauling line item will go over budget. Along with the astronomical rise in energy, and all the other little things that add up. A proactive measure would be to add a trash hauling surcharge to residents who use the Crescent street facility, which from an operational standpoint could mean, on trash pickup. I’d love to see the Common Council have to actually vote on increasing fees to collect trash while they dither on making a decision to contract on trash hauling. But that would mean that our government is thinking like an operational business, instead of some high school musical.

  • MGeake

    Oh TG, you had to know I’d comment!

    First, as to your point #6, you’re right, the city can control. But the proper question is will the city control? You only have to look at our current Crescent Street transfer station to see that DPW’s oversite has been woefully inadequate. What makes you believe that will change?

    Now to your comment about our ability to “separate fact from fiction” and vote on the proposal: when I get a packet containing all the facts, I’ll be able to judge this project on its merits. But right now, I don’t even see a propossed contract, just a “term sheet” (which has absolutely no legal standing).

    So tell me TG, does zoning approve projects without seeing all the facts, just what its tax impact is? If so, I am very, very frightened!

  • Anonymous

    everyone knows the Meadow st closes when it rains and we all know Lajoies does not comply with parking and traffic control there has been pictures taken each day for a month no one can dispute this.The boards all connected to decisions know about the conditions for kids and the concern for safety.

    Where were the ones who know about what the land is being used for and what problems are here and now along Meadow st and Woodward.

    Its funny how responsible parties seem to be missing from the action while others went to the meeting to make sure their tracks all all covered.

    No one has brought up what is already allowed into the air for pollutants from the 45 companies in the area,the two major players are the power station and Norwalk Housing ,their oil burners spew a lot itself.

    We currently have idiots running the show, we propose a change.

  • turfgrrl

    MGeake: Isn’t your Public Works Committee chair supposed to ask for details etc before passing up an agenda item to the full council? You did vote against sending this to the council right? You did ask for all this detail during your many committee meetings right? I see that the city web site has the last meeting minutes of Jan. 2, 2008 where Mr. Alvord said:
    UPDATE ON SOLID WASTE DISPOSAL EFFORTS

    Mr. Alvord said that the proposals arrived on November 30th but have not yet been opened. The comparative analysis has been completed. Mr. Alvord said that depending upon how the tipping fees are set, they should be able to recover their costs.

    Seems like there was plenty of opportunity to ask for more details at this committee, no?

    See, in our Zoning committees, we ask questions, ask for reports all the time. We then read our packets. And then ask more questions.

  • old-timer

    Does the council have any real choices ? It sounds like a deal was made already and the council’s role is strictly ceremonial. It is not as if they are looking at selecting the best of several options.
    If they do not rubber-stamp City Carting and the Meadow St transfer station, what then ? Will City Carting, or someone else, agree to run Crescent St and haul the solid waste away at a reasonable price ?
    Who is City Carting ? Where did they get the money to buy out Waste Management ? Are they a legitimate company with no mob connections ? Is there a valid DEP permit now for City Carting ?

  • Commercial Traffic Question

    If Hal’s concern about Crescent street is the long line of commercial trucks lining the road, then where are these trucks going to line up on Meadow street? That is a road with a firehouse, apartments, homes, etc. Lining up trucks with trash does not seem like a positive approach in that neighborhood.

    Plus these trucks have to drive deeper into South Norwalk, versus the Crescent site…which is closer to I 95.

    I am all for saving the town money- but what is the point in shifting a lot of the traffic to a residential area.

    Give them the contract but don’t push off the commercial traffic to SONO.

    These concepts are mutually exclusive.

  • just observing

    Not that I agree with pushing this smelly contract down the throats of South Norwalk residents and I think more needs to be discussed before anything is signed but, anyone happen to notice that this is the same statement the Ms Brown makes everytime her fellow council people take a stand on a particular issue that they don’t want passed or all of a sudden she realizes she may not get re- elected next time because there is a group in the audience that opposes something? “As a council member I was rushed, I didn’t have enough information, and then there was limited time,
    ” Democratic Councilwoman Amanda Brown said. “Some of us were caught off guard by this. We didn’t have time to talk to staff, it was passed through committee and came to the council for a vote.”

  • Anonymous

    Mike I’ve voted for you thinking you’d be smarter than the usual types we get running for office. But if you aren’t seeing information you need before you have to vote don’t you think the onus is on you?

  • Anonymous

    Many times we see things like this get pushed through with little or no consideration and background work. You can’t blame any one council member for this but you can blame those presenting it. If you have ever been to any city meetings and have ever seen some of the footwork that goes on before a council meeting then you would know that the director of whatever department wnats something pushed through asap because A. They completely didn’t look at the document when it first arrived, B. They believe that what they say id gospel and how dare anyone second guess their decisions or C. They have already made the agreements prior to presentation and present it to committee as only a formality. Then there’s alot of back and forth arguments until somebody in committee says, oh hell, not such a big deal, pass it on to the full council and let them decide. Or its a special interest for someone and they fight to the finish to get it moved on. These a practices that have been done for so long that its laughable when I see that a council member says they haven’t had enough time to read it. Then who the heck passed it on to the full council Tinkerbell? Give me a break, sit in on some of these meetings sometime and you’ll see what I mean.

  • MGeake

    #3: That’s exactly what I am doing — demanding the documents so that I can make an informed decision. I’m am not on the Public Works Committee, so I wasn’t involved in any of this until it was submitted to the full council.

    #7: The onus is on me to do what, demand that I have all the information before I vote on a proposal? That’s exactly what I’ve been doing since I first saw this.

  • Anonymous

    According to the city website these are the members of Public Works
    BONDI, FRED A
    GEAKE, MICHAEL
    HEMPSTEAD, DOUGLAS E
    HILLIARD, CARVIN J
    KRUMMEL, WILLIAM M,
    LINDSTROM, LAUREL E
    STRANITI, KELLY L

  • Anonymous

    So Mike has never attended a meeting?

  • Anonymous

    Yes tracks have been covered on Woodward and Meadow st havn’t they?

    What some boards should do is go back and revisit sites and decisions made it just may make Norwalk a better place to live. Compliance is a very easy word to forget in Norwalk as well.

    The lies started the moment the package was sent accross the table to the first set of onlookers.Kummel asks if this was the proposal Alvord simply said no its the contract waiting to be signed.This was only what two weeks ago?

    Defending anyone in office in Norwalk is political suicide.

    I see hear and do nothing seems to be the creed and has been no matter who is mayor.Its works for them it should work for us.

    How can anyone take the public works seriously when they have spent millions on Meadow and South Main st trying to make 1 drain to work when if you simply dug it up and replaced it we could of saved all kinds of money time and road closings.Make the drain work and come back and talk to us about other projects.

    There has been illegal dumping and disposing of oily bottoms at the existing transfer station.There was a time when the blog would of put on damaging pictures and information or simply highlighted the past problems.

    Issues that cost the city money are carefully balanced between boards and departments so everyone can get a slice of the pie no wonder its taking so long for this contract to surfice the line before this was wrapped around city hall past the closed concession stand.

    It was said the traffic study was done but didn’t have that first night when Hal said here is the contract.Where is it and when was it done? Who did it? Its funny how the last traffic study was done to favor Rowyaton streets.Why can’t we use the same set of numbers or have they been lost already?

    Beware Rowyaton you will see some change that ought to stir the pot just right.Your village creek could be in trouble as well many sites around this propoasal was ignored by other departments and boards,they were allowed to expand or contunue without proper guildlines.Why not open all the files on and around this Meadow st site.

  • Anonymous

    Mr. Alvord said that depending upon how the tipping fees are set, they should be able to recover their costs.

    Mr Alvord said he would try and put the other transfer station out of business by lowering the tipping fee.His whole mindset was not that of a department head he was very caustic towards one of the bidders,maybe the reason after two years we only have one candidate where is the talk about this? Didn’t McQuaid caution him in a meeting not to slam other bidders in public until this was over.Now maybe a court case from outside bidders I truly hope it comes to that.Its only Norwalks money and we have plenty of it for crap like this don’t we?

    It never ends in Norwalk does it?

    The other transfer station is also now in South Norwalk why havn’t we heard about that site as well? Didn’t the state pass some permits through for that other station? Just recently?

  • MGeake

    I am chair of the Health, Welfare. Public Safety, and Emergency Management Committee.

    I am a member of the Land Use, Personnel, Finance, and Public Power Committees.

    Five committees is quite enough for me. I have no idea why I am listed on the city’s website as being on the Public Works Committee; I certainly have no part of maintaining that site, and I was never appointed to that committee!

  • Anonymous

    the same people take care of the police website its obvious.Outdated or bad information on both sides,but who cares its Norwalks money.

    You can only be a lion tamer in so many forums 5 is ok just think if you were mayor you could go to them all in between ribbon cuttings.

  • Old Timer

    Anybody notice Hal Alvord mentioned Waste Management Co several times Wednesday night ?
    Maybe that’s because the only permit for Meadow St is in the name of Waste Management and DEP has been told City Carting is “managing” it for them. Meadow St Partners, LLC, bought the site from Waste Management over a year ago. Meadow St Partners and City Carting share the same address in Stamford.

    The following is a brief summary of the current status of the referenced solid waste facility located at 8-18 Meadow Street and 30-32 Meadow Street:

    Permittee: Waste Management of Connecticut, Inc.

    Operator: City Carting (working for Waste Mgmt. under contract)

    Tonnage allowed: 8-18 Meadow Street – no more than 500 tons per day of municipal solid waste (MSW) and construction/demolition waste (C&D); limited to 250 tons per day of MSW – both waste streams have to be transferred daily off-site.

    30-32 Meadow Street – no more than 200 tons per day of paper/cardboard and commingled or source separated recyclable bottles (metal, glass, plastic).

    Permit number: Permit No. 1030538-MA/PO issued June 29, 2001
    Expiration date: October 16, 2005

    The permittee submitted a timely application for renewal of the permit on June 17, 2005 (application # 200501617). The Department has not finalized the renewal application but has made the decision to allow the current operation to continue until such time as the permit renewal request is completed. The permit renewal application does not include any increases in the daily tonnages or changes to the waste streams accepted.

    Reportedly, the City of Norwalk is involved in on-going discussions with Waste Management and the DEP to transfer the permit.

    If you have specific questions on the permit renewal application please contact Ms. Elaine Coelho of the Waste Engineering and Enforcement Division at (860) 424-3304.

    Waste Engineering & Enforcement Division

    Bureau of Materials Management & Compliance Assurance

    (860) 424-3313

  • Anonymous

    seems Lajoies has a problem as well,they can’t park right they can’t conduct business within its property and the city wants what? Where is Zoning on this we did hire some help didn’t we for that department?

    Its going to be a long summer if something isn’t done ,now its talk to simply block Meadow st and show Moccia how a community can cripple a city.

    We want that quality of life that was promised when Dick was elected.

    I guess the joke was on us,more crime now than ever and using last year doctored crime reports to show what? Rillings has his head up his arse?

    Now we have a few councilors trusting the DPW as if its not bad enough on Meadow st,now what is it that South Norwalk can do to help its city?

    Maybe a protest march or a simple sit it on Meadow st on all issues .We have plenty of pissed off people who simply have had it with the upper crust who enjoys to go eat on washinton st and not be around for the riots robberies and the killings and say we are like everyone else.

    Read your police news more crime on washinton st last night not the kind that brings in tourism.

  • ex cop

    If Waste management sold out to City Carting doesn’t City Carting need to get it’s own permit ? This sounds like a guy who bought a car running it on the prior owner’s plates, for years after the plates expire. Isn’t there something in the permits that cancels them when the business is sold ? Could it be there is no valid permit for the Meadow St operation now ? How could Hal and all the outside experts he hired miss something like that ?

  • old timer

    TG:
    The City does not take construction and/or demolition waste now, anywhere. City Carting may be taking it at Meadow St. The only place in town licensed to take C & D waste now is another, privately owned business on Chestnut St. Hal wants to start taking such waste in the belief it will be a money maker for the City and the City will be able to put this local business out of business.

  • Anonymous

    #19 he hopes to put them out of business take all the traffic and add to his scheme.Wonder if those vehicles will be included in the crystal ball count?

    This is indeed a Norwalk moment,where some people actually think with a title they know more than the average shmo.Its great we are able to weed out these old Norwalkers the I know whats good for the city before they think about mayor.It would be safe to say some political know it alls will be weeded out as the city runs further into the hole.

    In the meantime anyone see my quality of life,living in Norwalk I have seemed to have lost it.

  • AnonymousToo

    NORWALK NEIGHBORS FOR OPEN GOVERNMENT
    INVITES YOU TO
    TWO CHANCES TO STAND UP FOR YOUR RIGHTS

    ATTENTION RESIDENTS OF SOUTH NORWALK AND ANY CITIZEN WHO CARES ABOUT FAIRNESS

    6/24 TUESDAY 6:30PM CITY CARTING TRASH DISPOSAL Common Council Special Meeting
    City Hall 3rd Floor Council Chambers
    No public participation allowed !

    6/24 TUESDAY 8 PM COMMON COUNCIL VOTE ON WASTE CONTRACT
    City Hall 3rd Floor Council Chambers
    Come speak your mind !

    FIND OUT HOW CITY PLANS TO EXPAND A TRASH TRANSFER STATION IN SOUTH NORWALK ON MEADOW STREET

    WHY SHOULD YOU CARE?

    City , Mayor and Common Council are rushing to approve a plan without including review of impact on your neighborhood

    Even more trucks on Meadow Street 6 days a week

    Air pollution, noise and polluted water runoff has plagued the community for years and it is time for the City to enforce its laws

    PLEASE TELL YOUR NEIGHBORS AND PASS THIS ON TO YOUR CHURCH, YOUR FRIENDS

    If questions, call 858-1537 or Your Council person or your State Legislator!!

  • Anonymous

    be nice if they fixed the storm drain on meadow and south main st.Its been over a year with workers working on this one drain how can it be cost effective at this point.The same people in charge of the drain want a transfer station,maybe they should do one job at a time research and actually do the work right on the drain.

    Traffic study was done this week yet hal said it was done.This week had no school busses coming from the bus depot on wilson st,and Norwalk had no school,how could this be even close to a study?

    Fred Bondi knows all about the deal what made him partners in crime?

    I say simply shut down meadow st for a couple of hours and complain about all of South Norwalks ills if anything it will give Rillings an excuse to explain why so much overtime.

  • faithful reader

    TG:
    You use the expression “political flunky” frequently. In your view, about half the crowd at the hearing was political flunky, half was not. I suspect this is a code word for folk who disagree with you, but I would be interested to hear your definition. Are council people “political flunkies” ? How about people who sit on boards and commissions ? Dictionary definitions don’t seem to fit your use of the expression.

  • turfgrrl

    faithful reader: The term I use for people who disagree with me is “most people.” I use political flunkie, somewhat affectionately, as short hand for anyone who is “in politics” which would absolutely include people who sit on boards and commissions, like myself, or people who show up at the “TC” meetings, are in the “TCs” etc. Also in the food group is political junkie and wonkie. There are no wookies that I’m aware of in Norwalk.

  • faithful reader

    Word History: The word flunky has come into Standard English from Scots, in which the word meant “liveried manservant, footman,” coming at least by the 19th century to be a term of contempt. The word is first recorded and defined in a work about Scots published in 1782. The definition states that a flunky is “literally a sidesman or attendant at your flank,” which gives support to the suggestion that flunky is a derivative and alteration of flanker, “one who stands at a person’s flank.”
    Sounds a lot like the ever popular “butt boy”
    Some of us would prefer not to be considered anybody’s flunky, having minds of our own, and no taste for politics..