October 29, 2007 9:11 am

Norwalk: Generating Our Own Electricty

Bill Krummel, as chair of the council’s Public Power Committee, is calling for a meeting the last week before the election to discuss how to get from point A, the idea to point B, doing something about it.

The chairman of Norwalk’s Public Power Committee has invited 2nd and 3rd Taxing Districts officials to City Hall Tuesday night to share their experiences in the municipal power realm.”I want to find out more about the two districts in the city that distribute their own power and generate some power, and see if we can’t work out something that would use their base and expand it to the city,” said Councilman William M. Krummel, chairman of the committee.

South Norwalk Electric and Water, as well as the 3rd Taxing District Electric Co., buy their electricity through the Connecticut Municipal Electrical Energy Cooperative and sell it to customers at rates lower than do their private competitors, according to district officials.

CT Jobs George E. Leary, general manager for the 3rd Taxing District, and John M. Hiscock, general manager for SNEW, have agreed to attend Tuesday night’s meeting, participate in discussion and provide information about their electric systems, according to Krummel.

The Public Power Committee is scheduled to meet Tuesday at 7:30 p.m. in Room 101 of City Hall, 125 East Ave.

The Common Council formed the committee last year to explore whether the city should form a Norwalk Power Authority to combat rising electricity costs by private electric companies.

The committee, however, has not met for months, and may lack the dollars needed to perform a feasibility study. Earlier this year, the city approved $50,000 in its 2007-08 operating budget for the study, which has yet to begin. To date, several firms have answered the city’s request-for-proposals, a first step in finding a firm to perform the actual study.

Former Mayor Bill Collins, who raised the idea of the city pursuing municipal power, said the process has been “painfully slow” and that $100,000 will be needed to perform the feasibility study. The 3rd Taxing District has committed $25,000, making $75,000 available. The 2nd Taxing District hasn’t committed any dollars yet, according to Collins.

Collins, however, believes that there is broad support for the city pursuing public power.

“When I first raised this about four years ago, there was a lot of yawning. Now, when you stop and talk to people, there’s so much support, even across party lines, for obvious reasons. People are getting killed with their electric bills,” Collins said. “It’s got public momentum behind it.”

So far, the 3rd Taxing District has agreed to commit $25,000 toward a feasibility study, according to David L. Brown, district commission chairman. Brown some people at the 2nd Taxing District think that public power “probably wouldn’t work” for the city.

“I’m willing to spend some money to see if it can,” Brown said. “I think there’s a lot more benefits to have a citywide electric facility.”

Michael K. Geake, a 2nd Taxing District commissioner and at-large council candidate, has pitched municipal power as a way to save the city money and put those savings toward repairing infrastructure. Geake, however, opposes put 2nd Taxing District money into a feasibility study. Asking the district to do so amounts to asking the “lowest-income taxpayers in the city to subsidize lowering the electric rates for the highest-income rate payers in the city.”

“The 2nd Taxing District is the lowest income district in the city. It will get absolutely no benefit from the Norwalk (Public) Power Authority,” Geake said. “We have our own power. We won’t be getting a cutback.”

Councilman Douglas E. Hempstead, a member of the Public Power Committee, said the city should not give up on exploring public power. At the same time, the idea will require more dollars than have been allocated, according to him.

“At this particular time, unless there’s more money put into the pot, it probably won’t move forward. It’s a question of priorities and funding,” Hempstead said. “It doesn’t mean we should give up on it. (But) without the next step, we’re kind of treading water here.”

As a SNEW customer I disagree with Mr. Geake. SNEW is holding a deposit of my money and plans to pay an uncompetitive interest rate on it. They could certainly spare $50k and join in on a joint public power investigation that would benefit SNEW customers.

source: The Hour, Power Committee seeks input from taxing district officials, By ROBERT KOCH, October 29, 2007

http://www.MGeake.org MGeake

Oh, you had to KNOW I’d jump in on this one!!!

The issue is not being able to “spare $50K” of our ratepayers’ money — and unlike CL&P, it is our ratepayers’ money — the issue is our fiduciary responsibility to use that money for our ratepayers’ benefit, not as a charitable contribution to the more wealthy residents of Rowayton, Silvermine, West Norwalk, …

Remember that we, too, pay property taxes, so we, too, have contributed to what the city has already approprated. That is only fair, as the money raised from the NPA will benefit South Norwalk. But to ask us to pay for that survey twice, when our electric rates will not change one bit, is more than a little bit unreasonable.

As for the rate paid on your deposit, TG, that complaint is more properly directed to your representatives in Hartford, Bruce Morris and Bob Duff. We pay the statutorily-specified rate.
http://www.MGeake.org MGeake

Now that I am through venting at TG, let’s discuss the meeting tomorrow evening (which leads me to pray for a breakthrough in cloning, ’cause I ahd plans to be at the library in East Norwalk).

My understanding — amusingly, from a question at yesterday’s debate as I have not [yet] been included in the invite list — is that what they want to discuss is the possibility of the taxing districts extending their service areas to include the rest of the city.

Oh, were that allowed! Many years ago, the taxing districts were granted absolute monopolies in their respective areas. The flip side of that is that the taxing districts are probited, by statute, from straying beyond their defined areas. To allow this would be grossly unfair to the investor-owned utilities (i.e. CL&P).

The only way what I have proposed works is that deregulation mandated that consumers be allowed to choose from competing suppliers, and that the owners of transmission facilities (i.e. CL&P’s power lines) had to make them available to competing suppliers are a “reasonable” rate (again, the taxing districts’ were exempted from this and their monopolies were preserved). The only participation I envisioned from the taxing districts was contracted services for only as long as it takes the NPA to grow to critical mass.
turfgrrl

Mike, the minute I saw the headline this morning I knew we’d be discussing this

Maybe you’d like to explain how its the First Taxing District that is supplying water pipes, presumably water too, to the third taxing district? (Osborne Ave.) An certainly if you go by SNEW’s decision to let customers generate power back off independent generators to fill in emergency grid peaks, then there’s clearly been some tweaks to that age old rule about monopolies etc. Plus didn’t CT deregulate for some competition?

I’m not saying that the interest rate should be competitive, although there’s a thought, I’m saying that SNEW is sitting on some free money there. And to generate $50k off that is possible. And good financial guru knows how to do that. If you are using that free money to bring rates down, or improve operations that is indeed noble, but R&D investment, that is the lack there of, has put us all into the position that we are in right now.

With the amount of outages SNEW delivers in SoNo, and the mere fact that I can’t open an account or pay my bill electronically indicates to me at least that SNEW is not investing back in operational efficiencies. SNEW does have to make it easier for businesses to open up, otherwise its just contributing to the economic fortunes of other areas of Fairfield County.
http://www.MGeake.org MGeake

I’ll grant that we’re a bit behind the times as far as technology is concerned. Mary pays all our bills; she pays every one she can electronicly, but she hand delivers the electric and water payments. Beyond that, I’d like to see us change out all those old-fashoned meters for ones that can be read remotely, ’cause then you have broadband over power lines, which could be followed by telephone service, cable television, …

As for R&D, we spend a significant hunk of change there(come to the annual meeting October 16th when the audited financial reports of your utilities must be approved by the electors / ratepayers), and perhaps you’ve forgotten all the work we’re doing to rebuild the generating plant, replace old transformers and other equipment, …

Water is different, and it is regulated by an entirely different section of the Connecticut General Statutes. It was not deregualated, and we weren’t required to allow Aquarion (or the First Taxing District, for that matter) use of our water mains. Other parts of Norwalk, outside of the taxing districts, do get water from us and from the First Taxing District.

As for being able to generate the requested $50K, that is absolutely not the point. A municipal power authority is not a project that will benefit SNEW ratepayers (beyond that to which they will already have contributed through their fair share of property taxes), so it is not a proper use of ratepayer funds, and I will not breach my fiduciary responsibility by voting against the interests of SNEW ratepayers.

You can keep phrasing the request in different ways, but the answer will remain the same: SNEW ratepayers money must only be used for something that benefits them!
anonymous

Mike, if the city goes to your scheme, then the 2nd Taxing District will benefit from the extra $’s generated that will go towards improving the city’s infrastructure. SO, SNEW ratepayers will receive a benefit from this happening.
http://www.MGeake.org MGeake

#5 and the taxpayers are paying their property taxes to fund the city’s paying for that study. Why should the Second Taxing District — who won’t benefit from the rate decrease — pay twice (through their property taxes AND through their electric bills, while Rowayton, Silvermine, West Norwalk, et al — who WILL get a rate decrease — only have to pay once (through their property taxes)?

Are you telling me that 30-35% of the infrastructure improvements will be in the Second Taxing District? That’s what you’re saying our share of the bill should be!!!
http://www.MGeake.org MGeake

See, this is why I took issue with the mayor’s request: roughly 1/3 of the bill was given to Second Taxing District ratepayers (whose electric bills will not change), roughly 1/3 of the bill was given to Third Taxing District ratepayers (whose electric bills will not change), and only 1/3 of the bill goes to the rest of the city (who will be the only ones whose electric bills will be decreased).
MGeake

Great news for South Norwalk and for the environment! The CT DPUC has given preliminary approval to the rebuilding of SNEW’s generating plant to burn 100% renewable landfill gas.

The Connecticut Post has the article online: http://www.connpost.com/ci_7816327
Anonymous

I am not making this up. NASA has a program to zap electricity to earth to meet human electric needs by putting solar panels on the moon. The problem isn’t the technology but getting the panels to space.
Anonymous

Won’t the state and federal government pay for solar panels for your home and CL&P pays you for making electricity rather than you paying them to take.!?!?!?!!!
Anonymous

Yale put solar panels one that new medical school research building on Amistad St.
Anonymous

� Two primary wires came down in the area of Strawberry Hill and Wolfpit avenues Tuesday, causing 812 Connecticut Light & Power customers to lose electricity.
11:32 a.m. to
4:06 p.m

“It couldn’t have happened at a worse time

Normally when wires fall, only a couple dozen customers lose power. Devices on top of utility poles called reclosers act like circuit breakers, isolating the problem to a small area

but what was the problem?

Mayor Richard A. Moccia was among the customers affected by the outage, but he said it only lasted briefly

odd how the mayor was around for comments for this and not the killing of a resident.

taking care of what we have now would seem to be a priority wouldn’t you think?
Anonymous

How are you getting this news? A police radio?
Anonymous

Citing your source will add credibility and believability, if that is a word, to your posts.
Anonymous

Where I have to rely on The Hour for the facts it was this that gave me the post.

its odd not a word from any one public official on the tragic loss of a resident.

why cite a source its obvious with or without one the bottom line is the problem with an outage like this.Something fell through the cracks.

but thats why we have

Bill Krummel, as chair of the council�s Public Power Committee, to discuss how we might do something about it.may not be in his real so who else would help us?

so lets continue to highlight the problems so we can offer some solutions .

Any suggestions on this one now that we have sastified a skeptic?

By JARED NEWMAN
Hour Staff Writer

NORWALK � Two primary wires came down in the area of Strawberry Hill and Wolfpit avenues Tuesday, causing 812 Connecticut Light & Power customers to lose electricity.

“It couldn’t have happened at a worse time, I know, Christmas Day,” said Frank Poirot, a CL&P spokesman, “but sometimes these things happen, and we apologize for any inconvenience that we may have caused our customers.”

A Strawberry Hill Avenue resident called the Norwalk Fire Department at 11:32 a.m. to report an outage, and the department notified CL&P, according to Deputy Chief David Lepus.

Power was fully restored at 4:06 p.m. The exact cause of the falling wires isn’t known.
“We think it was the wind,” Poirot said. “It was nothing really obvious like a car hitting a pole or something.”

Normally when wires fall, only a couple dozen customers lose power. Devices on top of utility poles called reclosers act like circuit breakers, isolating the problem to a small area.

But Poirot said the particular location of the outage was on the opposite side of an area that’s divided by reclosers. He had no explanation for why the distribution on the other side was so broad.

“It’s still a smaller number than, say, if we weren’t able to isolate the outage just to the Wolfpit Avenue area of Norwalk,” Poirot said.

Mayor Richard A. Moccia was among the customers affected by the outage, but he said it only lasted briefly.

“For the most part, they got out there pretty fast,” Moccia said of the CL&P workers.

Dick gives more credit to CL&P than his own depts over this last holiday.

While we are at it any idea how many transformer fires we have had in the last 6 months in Norwalk?

Don’t need a radio for that as well simply knew someone assiting overseeing the cleanup.

ok with that fact?
Anonymous

Not that this would interest some but around the holiday’s some hospitals send patients home on vents or o2 machines powered by electricity so they can be with their families. Knowing some of the firefighters thay have said in the recent past they had with power loss this situation come up.

Maybe what seems like nothing to some could mean a life to others.So pick apart the facts but think about the real life applications when it comes to the residents.

Simply something to think about while reading the content of some of these posts other than it was xmas.
Anonymous

I am not making this up. NASA has a program to zap electricity to earth to meet human electric needs by putting solar panels on the moon.

HOUSTON – The space shuttle Atlantis’ mission to the international space station likely will be pushed back a few more days or weeks as engineers study problems with electrical connectors and the extension cord to Norwalk Ct.

I guess this posting is going to lose credibility.
Anonymous

Lunar solar power systems have been in the works for over 25 years. Moon systems could supply solar power to earth, but such a system won’t happen for another 25 years or more. Cordless charging for portable electronics using magnetic fields and their frequencies to send energy to match the electronic device will soon become common. Cordless charging solutions already exist for some low power consuming items. Cords for charging will be a thing of the past in the near future.
Anonymous

“taking care of what we have now would seem to be a priority wouldn’t you think?”

We all agree with you about city problems. I witnessed a power transformer and wires explode in Darien at the Dunkin Donuts on post road in November with sparks falling down on a mother with her two children. It is a serious situation. Planning for the future is important, too. The city will charge the taxpayers for energy cost increases not the current politicians. Energy costs will increase dramatically in the next ten years according to the documents I have read. This year CL&P asked for a 50% increase in the transmission fee, which will raise your total bill by 25%. $25 more for every $100 on your current bill. We need to be reactive and proactive. The city is blaming plastic bags, school bus fuel and heating oils to justify an increase of millions of tax dollars.

Gasoline has doubled in price in the past three years. The Middle East is rich and powerful from oil. Polluting the earth. Efficient use of energy would give Norwalk an edge over the richer towns. We spend too much time ignoring problems. Energy efficiency is coming. Chevrolet Volt finalized decisions for the release at the end of 2010. Energy costs will continue to sky rocket. What alternatives have we planned to save money?
npd supporter

What alternatives have we planned to save money?

What about two man cruiser teams?

As it is two cruisers are needed for every call and with the workload at night there is no time for patrols ask any patrolman.Valuable time is lost waiting for backup and puts our officers at risk.

How much gas would we save?

anyone on the council know what we spend in gas as it is per shift?